About Amerisurv| Contact    
Magazine | Newsletter    
Flickr Photos | Advertise    
HomeNewsNewsletterAmerisurv DirectoryJobsStoreAuthorsHistoryArchivesBlogVideosEvents
 
advertisement


Subscriptions
Sponsored By

Software Reviews
Continuing Series
     RTN
An RTN expert provides everything you need to know about network-corrected real-time GNSS observations.
Click Here to begin the series,
or view the Article PDF's Here
76-PageFlip Compilation
of the entire series
Test Yourself

Got Answers?
Test your knowledge with NCEES-level questions.
  Start HERE
Meet the Authors
Check out our fine lineup of writers. Each an expert in his or her field.
Wow Factor
Sponsored By


Product Reviews
Partner Sites

machinecontrolonline 


lbszone.com

GISuser.com

GeoJobs.biz

GeoLearn

 

Spatial Media LLC properties

Associates

ASPRS

newsnow 

Home arrow Archives   The American Surveyor     

Thought Leader: The Back Story Print E-mail
Written by John Stock, PS, CFM   
Saturday, 12 March 2016

A 85Kb PDF of this article as it appeared in the magazine—complete with images—is available by clicking HERE

Ambush
As NSPS President in 1986, I was invited to the NCEES annual conference in St. Louis. Area 5 Director Chuck Tapley (now deceased) was with me. Wow! What a lesson for a dirt surveyor from Colorado. Black tie, buttoned down and totally controlled behind the scenes by ASCE (American Society of Civil Engineers). One issue for discussion and the reason I was there was concerning certain proposed laws and rules in Florida about what engineers could do and what surveyors could do legally. (Think money).

The Public Use
The NCEES model law is used nationwide by many states as written or with modifications to suit the locale. Since NCEES also produces the national exams I am thinking they have way too much power. So what is behind the curtain? Is this about fees and subsequent survival of the organization as well? After all less surveyors means less exam fees. Then there's the insistence of nationwide rules to make the licenses portable across state lines, like engineers. The public reason, IMO for this meeting is: "why aren't there more people signing up to be surveyors"?

The Rant
1. The need just isn't there. Technology has turned the profession upside down and shaken out a good 70% of what would have been surveyors in the `80s.
2. The obsession with an ABET accredited four year degree for initial licensure has kept many away financially. Why would you spend all the hard earned money or scholarship on a profession the at best makes 60 to 70 % of what an engineer or architect could make?
3. I have friends and colleagues that teach and have taught at New Mexico State University over in Las Cruces and have been a speaker there myself. So why does a student in their program of "Surveying Engineering" (choke) have all the curriculum required higher math and very little on real property boundary law and the USPLSS. Again IMO it is outside influence through the NCEES and the State Boards that are obsessed with higher math, which they all had to take, and think surveyors have to do the same.
Okay, End of Rant

Bottom line
Protect the franchise to boundary survey only by properly examined and licensed individuals. This is all we have that's exclusive and makes us "special" and marketable and if we lose it we will be like Texans at the Alamo. This just in: as of Email to my office on February 16, 2016. The AZ legislature is proposing to eliminate registration of geologists and landscape architects. Do you hear the "fire bell in the night? You better!

Conclusions
Back in '86 we were too nice. NSPS was ambushed at the last minute and had to scramble just to get there and have a voice. The deference to engineers then and now may be because most surveyors work for large multi-disciplined firms and in general, with the exception of a few top of the line organizations surveyors are kept around as a support group (and sometimes scapegoat) for the engineers, architects and planners. The respect level is just not there, never has been. Even an accredited college degree has not and won't cure it.

John Stock PS, CFM, is an NSPS past president and is currently the Chief Surveyor, Flood Control District of Maricopa County, Arizona.

A 85Kb PDF of this article as it appeared in the magazine—complete with images—is available by clicking HERE

 
< Prev   Next >

 American Surveyor Recent Articles
Editorial 
Thought Leader: Land is Too Important to Be Left to Land Specialists
A while back I was searching the Internet for an old treatise on land titles. A Google query yielded a book published in 1914. The author was Charles Claudius Kagey and the book was titled "Land Survey and Land Titles, a book for boys and girls, a reference volume for property owners, a text ....
Read the Article
Jason E. Foose, PS 
Decided Guidance: Wacker vs. Price - Irony in Sevenfold
This month's case takes us to Phoenix, Arizona in 1950. The Arizona Supreme Court went all guns-a-blazin' in Wacker vs. Price (216 P.2d 707 (Ariz. 1950)). Maybe it's just me, but I'm sensing plenty of irony and have taken license to point it out along the way. I like what the Court did with this case ....
Read the Article
Allen E. Cheves 
Around the Bend - A Visit to Carlson Software
The Ohio River is one of America's greatest, running near 1,000 miles between Pittsburgh and the Mighty Mississippi. Much of the coal and other products that fueled our nation's industrial expansion flowed between the shores of this maritime ....
Read the Article
Lee Lovell, PS 
Surveying & Mapping Economics Part 3 - Customers & Services
This article continues an inquiry into the economic conditions of the Surveying and Mapping industry (NAICS 541370) using data from the U.S. Census Bureau. This time we will look at customers and services. The data comes from the Economic Census conducted every 5 years on American ....
Read the Article
Jerry Penry, PS 
True Elevation: Black Elk Peak
Black Elk Peak, located in the Black Hills region of South Dakota, is the state's highest natural point. It is frequently referred to as the highest summit in the United States east of the Rocky Mountains. Two other peaks, Guadalupe Peak in Texas and ....
Read the Article
Larry Trojak 
Bringing The Goods - Mobile Scanning an Integral Component
When Jim Smith, Jerrad Burns and Charlie Patton left the Memphis division of a major construction company in 2015, they took with them the knowledge of how to get even the most complex jobs done and what equipment could best serve them in making that happen. So when they joined West ....
Read the Article
 
Lee Lovell, PS 
Test Yourself 41: Integers, Integers, and Integers
ABF is a 5:12:13 triangle, ACF is a 48:55:73 triangle, ADF is a 3:4:5 triangle, and AEF is a 7:24:25 triangle, all with integer sides and inscribed in a semi-circle. What are the lengths of BC, CD, and DE? ....
Read the Article
Wendy Lathrop, PS, CFM 
Vantage Point: Sunset or Sunrise?
While we often think of legislated government programs as static, they do change over time. Such evolution and opportunity for transformation are part of the dialogue in reauthorizing these programs. Every so many years there is a sunset on each government program, and this September is the ....
Read the Article
 

deliciousrssnewsletterlinkedinfacebooktwitter

Amerisurv Exclusive Online-only Article ticker
Featured Amerisurv Events
List Your Event Here
please
contact Amerisurv


Google
 
AMERISURV TOP NEWS

JAVAD Intros
Spoofer Buster

GOT NEWS? Send To
press [at] amerisurv.com
Online Internet Content

Sponsor


News Feeds

 
Subscribe to Amerisurv news & updates via RSS or get our Feedburn
xml feed

Need Help? See this RSS Tutorial

Historic Maps
Careers

post a job
Reach our audience of Professional land surveyors and Geo-Technology professionals with your GeoJobs career ad. Feel free to contact us if you need additional information.

 

Social Bookmarks

Amerisurv on Facebook 

Amerisurv LinkedIn Group 

Amerisurv Flickr Photos 

Amerisurv videos on YouTube 

twitter

 




The American Surveyor © All rights reserved / Privacy Statement
Spatial Media LLC
905 W 7th St #331
Frederick MD 21701
301-620-0784
301-695-1538 - fax